Belzebuub's talk on the Book of Thomas the Contender
Belzebuub's talk on the Book of Thomas the ContenderSubscribe |
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Mon, 10/06/2008 - 01:24
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Matthew
Join Date: 2008-09-20 Forum Posts: 9 |
Hello everyone, Belzebuub gave an amazing talk yesterday, where he explored the Book of Thomas the Contender, which is one of my favourite texts from the Nag Hammadi library. It was great hear him bring his insights to this text which has so much depth, and he spoke about it in such a way that it really struck a chord for me. He got about half way through exploring the text in this talk; maybe he will come to the other half in another talk sometime. Anyway, one thing that struck me was how this Gnostic information is the same now as it was when this ancient text was written, and people have always had to overcome the same thing to awaken. On the surface a text like this can seem pretty obscure and distant to what we are trying to do here, but its it is essentially talking about the same thing Belzebuub teaches, and his talk combined the ancient and modern forms of Gnosis in a very powerful way, showing that they are one. This text is really a practical guide for the spiritual work and how to approach it, and his talk really got across the sheer reality of what it was saying - written thousands of years ago but just as relevent today. One thing that came across was the futility of getting trapped in the temporay things of this world, which are only going to end anyway. So why do we choose this over pursuing the spiritual and eternal, or why do we choose not to make the effort to uncover and confront why we make this choice? To do this we need to "examine ourselves" and see our self deception and ignorance, and as Belzebuub pointed out, there are few people who are truely interested in that. But why? Belzebuub spoke about how if we are drawn to matter, to physical things, we return to matter. And what really came across in the text, was the extremely powerful and pleasurable force pulling us to do that, which brings with it pain. Because of this force most people don't really want to know themselves or work on themselves, because they want to stay within it. So his talk really brought a focus on the need to look at why we pursue those temporary, physical things over something greater and immortal and what compels us in such a way. Consider these words from Jesus, found in the text: "For that which guides them, the fire, will give them an illusion of truth, and will shine on them with a perishable beauty, and it will imprison them in a dark sweetness and captivate them with fragrant pleasure. And it will blind them with insatiable lust and burn their souls and become for them like a stake stuck in their heart which they can never dislodge. And like a bit in the mouth, it leads them according to its own desire. And it has fettered them with its chains and bound all their limbs with the bitterness of the bondage of lust for those visible things that will decay and change and swerve by impulse. They have always been attracted downwards; as they are killed, they are assimilated to all the beasts of the perishable realm." - Jesus It really hit home, and Belzebuub explained the meaning behind this in such vivid way, and it really made me reflect on this. It was a profound talk - did anyone else feel the same way? It made me want to go back and re-read and explore the text too. I'd be interested to hear what anyone else got out of the talk. Matthew |
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Join Date: 2004-05-28
Forum Posts: 1009
Yeah, I love that book, starting from when you were helping us to understand it several months ago! :)
I got back out my Nag Hammadi, and was looking through it.... Some things really strike pretty deep, and so many things have many layers.
I generally try to read through these things and let the words sink into the consciousness, rather than being an intellectual study which I feel really debases the teaching.
Thanks for this commentary Matthew, and of course thanks to the Master for his talk,
Jim
Join Date: 2008-09-20
Forum Posts: 9
Thanks Jim, I hope the talk helped you peel back a few more layers of understanding. I know it helped me ;-)
Matthew
Join Date: 2003-08-28
Forum Posts: 292
I agree that it was a very powerful talk. It was particularly interesting to have an authority interpreting the text, because it gave those of us who already studied a chance to see where we went wrong, and what we interpreted correctly. It also demonstrated how those teachings have many layers. Except the one you mentioned Matthew, about the power of pleasure, I found the one about light feeding from the light especially revealing.
Matija
Join Date: 2005-11-22
Forum Posts: 26
is this talk recorded somewhere?
ian
Join Date: 2008-09-20
Forum Posts: 9
Hey Matija,
I agree that part was very striking too. Like Belzebuub said, the line "It is in light that light exists" is very profound and has many layers to it, and you could really feel the depth of it coming across in the talk.
Hi Ian - he has past talks on the audio section of his website. This one isn't up there, but maybe it will go up in the future. We'll have to keep an eye on it.
Matthew
Join Date: 2003-09-08
Forum Posts: 165
Hello everyone.
I really like the way Belzebuub explains things. It helps a lot. And as he said, there is plenty to reflect on in this text.
Another phrase from that text I find powerful is the one
"whilst you have time in this world.."
I'd like to listen to that talk again so I hope it goes up on his site.
Join Date: 2005-09-20
Forum Posts: 108
Hello Everyone,
There was so much life in that talk, in the words of the Master Belzebuub. I deeply felt his meaning when he spoke of the true Spiritual Brotherhood which is felt among those who are working on themselves.
He made the point that we must allow the Spirit, and not resist it, within us. I have seen this shamefully within myself - silencing the voice of intuition instead of doing the right thing which was awkward or difficult at that moment.
How difficult it is sometimes to separate from the egos which we have fed so much, to the point that it feels like we have merged with them and confuse them for ourselves. But peace is an almighty power, and acting with peace, anything is possible, even easy.
Can others relate to this? What does it take to experience this?
-Noah
Join Date: 2004-11-30
Forum Posts: 2930
Nice thread!
I really liked that talk, it was so profound for me...giving such a push of insights and motivation.
Noah, for me peace is something to earn.
Forces of clay take it away, have to be strong and break through it, strength brings peace.
Join Date: 2008-09-20
Forum Posts: 9
Hi all,
I just noticed that this text has been put under the "Live weekly Talks" section on Belzebuub's website:
"Commentries by Belzebuub on the Nag Hammadi library - the Gnostic teachings of Jesus and his disciples."
So it seems we can expect some more talks like this in the future :-)
Matthew
Join Date: 2005-09-20
Forum Posts: 108
That's great news, Matthew, it's so wonderful to look into these esoteric texts.
Vadim, I love that, peace has to be earned, yes, profound peace comes from having a very light conscience from doing the right thing. As the Master says, peace requires activity, it isn't relaxing and telling yourself that you feel peaceful, but is a real state that comes after overcoming egos.
One interesting thing I have found can seem like a paradox: although we should do the right thing even when it is difficult, it is not always difficult to do the right thing.
-Noah