Atman and Ego

Atman and Ego

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Fri, 08/08/2008 - 17:16
Shivoham

Join Date: 2005-09-22
Forum Posts: 171

Let each man raise the Self by Soul,
not trample down his Self,
Since Soul that is Self's friend
May grow Self's foe.

Soul is Self's friend when
Self doeth rule o'er Self,
But self turns enemy if
Soul's own Self hates
Self as not itself.

--Bhagavan Krishna

When you are completely filled with love, there is no war to fight, the egos simply have no room to bother you. You sweep them up and offer them at the Lady's feet.

#1
Fri, 08/08/2008 - 17:20
Paycus

Join Date: 2005-09-15
Forum Posts: 188

Could you explain the meaning of the verse? I get the gist of it but not fully.

All the best
Jackie

#2
Fri, 08/08/2008 - 17:25
pavlin

Join Date: 2004-09-08
Forum Posts: 716

"You sweep them up and offer them at the Lady's feet."

well said :)

#3
Sat, 08/09/2008 - 10:21
Shivoham

Join Date: 2005-09-22
Forum Posts: 171

Explaining the meaning...well, it can be taken differently by different people, depending on what your philosophy is, but the gist is a joke between the two meanings of Self, namely, Ego and Atman, the false and the true self.

The idea it is trying to put forth, then, from what I;ve gathered and meditated upon, is that often, the work with the egos can turn into a hassle, a sort of war, where subconscious bouts of anger and frustration can surface at the inability to be rid of the egos prancing about in your mind. It builds on itself, this 'war'. Of course, you've got to do this work, it's a 'key' component to the work, but the who play on words suggests that it you shouldnt trample down the ego...self turns enemy if soul's own self hates self as not itself....you cant get too caught up in the introspections, the egos are there, theyve been there, and theyre strong. Hating them is itself an ego. Recognizing that theyre indeed part of your being and filling yourself with awareness of what you are deep within and contemplating on this makes it easier to spot the egos, its like ink in milk. But being watchful like a sentry for them can provoke them, the mind is STUBBORN. The egos fight hard, and though some welcome this 'suffering' and call it part of the path, it needs not be. What matters is getting that GARBAGE out of your head, working with the Ninth Sphere, and altruism. If you dont get this last sentence, take the courses, youre not supposed to yet :)

But this is all my own observations. I feel troubled by the egos sometimes, and its precisely this. Its like trying to get kids into their seats or something...if yo ubother them and sitr them and chastise them theyll never go with it. But if you just let them go with a laugh and no attention, theyll tire, since thats all too often their objective, to bother you, no? Then you can sit them in their seats, in this case, Mother's lap :)

Laugh at your treacherous mind, and little by little it shall be purified. The ego suffers, the Buddha is free....Soul that is self's sfrind may grow self's foe, just like that, with that mystic laughter that sees beyond the egos and is absorbed in the eyes of the Divine Mother. Then you love all, all is perfect, even these egos, and you sweep them off, and place them at her feet, for they too can see that theyve nothing left to do in this vessel. It belongs to its rightful owner once again.

By this shall you raise the Self, the ATMAN, by Soul.

this, of course, is my own meditation. Ask Krishna if you want the truth, haha!

Love to all of you

Shivoham

#4
Sat, 08/09/2008 - 11:11
Dusty

Join Date: 2007-11-02
Forum Posts: 1136

the work with the egos can turn into a hassle, a sort of war, where subconscious bouts of anger and frustration can surface at the inability to be rid of the egos prancing about in your mind.

Yes, yes, exactly!

Laugh at your treacherous mind, and little by little it shall be purified.

Dear God, please let that be so! I had a dream that I was laughing at something that was trying to scare me and shock me. When I laughed, it disappeared. This makes sense to me.

What matters is getting that GARBAGE out of your head, working with the Ninth Sphere, and altruism. If you dont get this last sentence, take the courses, youre not supposed to yet :)

Please tell me more.

Dusty

#5
Sat, 08/09/2008 - 16:23
Shivoham

Join Date: 2005-09-22
Forum Posts: 171

Take the courses, my friend, those three things are at the core of all spiritual work, they are the keys of the Peter, the Stone upon which the body of Christ on earth is founded. That Gnostic Wisdom course is, if you dont mind my pun, 'of the essense.'

In my opinion, though, the work of Master Samael is the best tool to have on this whole Gnosis of the Age of Aquarius. I couldnt tell you how many things in the courses left me swarmed and distraught until I refined my views of what they meant in the words of Master Samael.

True Gnosis is about not adhering to anything you've been told, even the very things we learn here on this website. It is all guidance, but for anyone who does the essential things for the work, the path opens by itself; it is Dharma. Master Belzebuub didnt have online courses, he had a lesson on awareness and some guidance in astral work, and the rest of the path, what we are taught about here, is for the most part, from his experience. Bless him for giving us so much; it is God who speaks to us, but than again, it is God who is reading my words, no? The senses perceive, the mind analyzes, but the essence...it is the consciousness that experiences.

Belzebuub is a revolutionary. Any true Gnostic must also be a revolutionary. Take nothing at face value, even the noble teachings of the sages and masters. THIS is a revolution, by it you will be like Gotama, who shunned the wisdom of the Brahmins and found the truth instead while sitting under a tree.

Love to all of you

Shivoham

#6
Sun, 08/10/2008 - 05:44
Dusty

Join Date: 2007-11-02
Forum Posts: 1136

Take the courses, my friend, those three things are at the core of all spiritual work, they are the keys of the Peter, the Stone upon which the body of Christ on earth is founded. That Gnostic Wisdom course is, if you dont mind my pun, 'of the essense.

I've just completed Gnostic Wisdom. Nothing at all is taught about the 9th sphere, keys of the Peter, the stone upon which the body of Christ on earth is founded.

Dusty

#7
Sun, 08/10/2008 - 17:08
Shivoham

Join Date: 2005-09-22
Forum Posts: 171

Have you read the coursework? I took the courses once, and then I readthe books for them, and it was as if I had never taken them before...have you ever read a paragraph and then you read it over again and youre like WHOA I cant belive i didnt catch that, and gee, Im glad u went over it again...its like that, but only sort of.

Master Samael Aun Weor;s books are phenomenal, Master Belzebuubs books are as well, particularly on clarifying the coursework, but as for the flowery language, the esoteric ways to say things, its all in the work of Master Samael. The Ninth sphere is about the ninth sphere of the sephiroth, right there around the root of the body. The more you look into all of this, the more you find out about the symbology, like Peter and the body of Christ...thats just the bible, no philosophical treatises for that.

Once you have the seminal wisdom from here, everything ele you look into will be put into a wonderful perspective. So read those books...theyre great, like the image of Samael hangin out with some Elohim, sipping water with lemon in glasses of fine baccarat...classic, classic. Love him :)

Much love

Shivoham

#8
Sun, 08/10/2008 - 20:29
ian

Join Date: 2005-11-22
Forum Posts: 26

Dusty

I've just completed Gnostic Wisdom. Nothing at all is taught about the 9th sphere, keys of the Peter, the stone upon which the body of Christ on earth is founded.

It seems, that esoteric terminology, although very poetic, can cause some confusion.

The work in the 9th sphere is ALCHEMY - 2nd KEY
- step by step guidance can be found in the "Secret Knowledge, Hidden Wisdom"

The Best
ian

#9
Sun, 08/10/2008 - 21:51
Vadim

Join Date: 2004-11-30
Forum Posts: 2930

The terminology of 10 spheres seems to come from Kabala and its complex symbol of Tree of Life.
In one of its main aspects 9th sphere relates to sexuality.
Number 9 relates also to Tarot card Hermit.

There is some information about numerology in Belzebuub's "Astral Travel and Dreams" book.

#10
Mon, 08/11/2008 - 07:11
Dusty

Join Date: 2007-11-02
Forum Posts: 1136

Hi Ian,

Thanks for that. Yes, I clearly read the Alchemy chapters, though it would be good to go back and read the entire book again. I don't know if I'll be able to understand that kind of language ever. I was never educated in the fine arts. It was all computers, math and accounting.

I think I need to go get a degree in that area.

Dusty