Hello Apakhana,

Many different people say many different things. It can get confusing taking in what some people say and trying to get it to fit into an idea or system from somewhere else.
Thats why there is such a strong basis here of learning via practice and experience.
One doesn't have to listen to the weather man who may, or may no be right. When one is standing outside feeling the rain on their own face then they know its raining. They know how much its raining, they know where its raining, and they know how very very nice it feels to feel it rain.
All the best.

Good post! I like the analogy of the weatherman.

Anyone else got anything?

"You will recognize them by their deeds." For me it is as simpler as that.

Samael wrote something about this label he received, I think it was in the Hell, Devil, Karma book. He said that certain people knew his Being was going to bring revolutionary occult knowledge, so they described him as a demon, because he was beyond their belief system. This approach is quite usual nowadays too, unfortunately, even in things that have nothing to do with spirituality.

Take care,
Matija

Adam, I liked your weatherman analogy as well ;)

Sometimes it's hard for me to comprehend what someone has written or what someone believes, but then I remember that it doesn't really matter. I just need to be aware enough to work upon myself throughout the day. Right now, it is this personal work for me that is more important than things written. I can read all the spiritual teachings ever written, but what does it matter unless I am working on myself?

I have always enjoyed reading anything that was esoteric/occult. However, after a read I usually find myself with more questions than answers. So I'm trying to read less and do more these days.

From what I've read, and I cannot remember exactly what it was, it seems that beings are always allowed their "agency" or "free will." This means that angels may fall to the flames and demons may ascend into light thus perpetuating the cycle of life. This being the case, it may explain why some condemn Samael the demon while others praise Samael the prophet. Just an opinion on some things I have read.

Josiah

I will always have reservations about Samael and Beezulbub (sp?). I take everything 'they' wrote with a grain of salt, and through the filter that they may very well be evil, trying to lead me from the 'true' path. Of course, it's not like I'm on it anyway.

But luckily, thats O.K., experience above dogma. Seems reasonable to me. If I decide I don't like what they teach, or I feel it is wrong or evil. I leave.

Besides, I don't believe it can be inherently wrong to explore another realm, or talk to demons. I don't see why you would be guilty of sin, or evil, simply by association.

Belzebuub* is the right spelling

Hello Midknight,

I admire your approach to the teachings of those masters, especially in our days when there is so much extraordinary lie and outstanding manipulation, however, it is even more important to approach your own self in the same manner as you want to approach those who you do not trust.

Considering all the quantity of lie that already had entered our eyes and ears since we are born, which is now covering the surface of our hearts and which makes our understanding distorted, anyone should be first of all very attentive towards him self and all that is coming out of him/her.

Only in this manner will we be able to distinct lie form what might be truth.

A good thought to keep in mind, Gyorgi. I know through what experience I have had that I, or my ego, or my subconscious, or what term one chooses to apply, is no more trustworthy than strangers to myself.

I also notice that fear and lust seem to be very damning when in the astral, they both offer tremendous hazards to staying aware, and staying asleep. And since these both come from within ourselves, seems to be that regardless of anything else, the basic fact that our emotions, or ego, are very dangerous to both our spiritual exploration and our daily life, that they at least speak some truth.

Only time and effort will shed light on the rest.

Coincidently, I just remembered a semi-astral experience last night. Which is odd, since I usually remember things upon waking up, or nothing at all, and don't have them show up several hours after waking up.

I'm not sure of the relevance to this thread, but, I thought I should let you guys know that you just helped me remember at least a part of experience I didn't earlier today.

Merry christmas by the way!

Apakhana

Not all associations with the name Samael are evil. In another tradition the archangel Samael's name can be used for protection against evil. The archangel Samael is also associated with Tuesday, which I think was the day of Samael Aun Weor's birth.

What I find puzzling is that having been given the names of their personal daemons / inner guides, Belzebuub and Samael Aun Weor revealed these names to the world. From the little I have read I thought you were supposed to keep these names secret.